Hologram questions and....help - Page 2

McDougal · 09-15-09, 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by slp123

it is possible that when using an abrasive polish and a heavy cut pad, this will create holograms that will be virtually impossible to remove them without stepping down to a finer polish and lighter cut/polishing pad to bring the gloss and depth back to the paint and to remove marring and holograms from the previous polish.

Watch your speed (both the speed of the pad and the speed of you moving the buffer) and the amount of pressure being applied. For a rotory, very little to no pressure is needed, just the pressure of the machine will work in most situations.

Good luck

Thanks for the tip.

I think I am going to go back over at least one panel with the yellow pad and polish using less speed and pressure to see what happens. Hopefully that will fix the problems. If not I will pick up a lighter cut pad.

slp123 · 09-15-09, 12:43

good luck. Take some pics when you are finished

Accumulator · 09-16-09, 10:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by McDougal

..With regard to working to swirl remover for a longer period of time. I guess I have been a bit hesitant to do too much and have been erroring on the side of caution. Don't want to go through the clear coat...

With the vast majority of products, you have to work them a sufficiently long time in order to break the abrasives down (there are a *few* that simply don't break down but I don't think that's what you're using).

Failing to break down the abrasives will make all these issues much worse. Working the product long enough shouldn't imperil your clearcoat if you're using the right stuff to begin with.

And note that it's not a matter of *going through* the clear as you'll cause gotta-repaint-level damage long before that; you can only take off so much clear before you remove the UV protection and precipitate failure.

Quote:

Another thing. Will polish take out the holograms caused by the swirl remover, or do I need to make sure there are no holograms after each step.

You'll probably have holograms until the final step (or the penultimate one if you're planning to jewel/burnish the finish).

BUT...the terms "polish" and "swirl remover" are SOOOOO vague that it's hard to say what any differences between the products in question will really be. Companies use these words however they want and it gets confusing.

slp123 · 09-16-09, 10:41

^ +1. I agree

McDougal · 09-16-09, 09:55

I am using Megs Swirl-X as a swirl remover and will be using DG 105 as a polish. Any tips on applying the DG 105? I will be using their bonding agent as well.

Today I picked up a 5 inch backing plate for use on my Chicago Electric rotory with yellow megs Solo 1 foam pad. I was using the standard backing plate before which barely fit with the yellow pad. Needless to say it is WAY easier to work the buffer with the smaller backing plate because the smaller plate allows the pad to bend along the edges to contour to the curves of the car (that was a long sentence).

I am been using a version of the KBM method in conjunction with less pad speed and moving the buffer across the paint slower. It seems to be working pretty well. If there is a hologram they seem to be removed by a few passes with low pad speed.

I feel like I am making progress but I won't know for sure until I can get the car in direct sunlight. I am using an LED right now to check for holograms and they are MUCH less noticeable than they were, but there are still a few here and there.

With regard to the swirl remover, there are still some small scratches that can be seen upon close inspection with the LED. It is MUCH MUCH better than it was but there are still small scratches. I figure I don't want to chance it by going too far so I will probably just leave it where it is at.

I hope that after I get done with the entire process (swirl remover, polish, and wax) the car will look ok.

Accumulator · 09-17-09, 08:58

McDougal- Sorry, I've never used DG

I will say that Swirlk-X is a pretty mild product though.

McDougal · 09-17-09, 02:11

Well I finally had a chance to get the car into direct sunlight today. There are holograms all over the side of the car and even on the hood, which I waxed to protect it until my polish comes in this weekend. They aren't everywhere by any means, but are pretty prminent in the "hard to reach" areas, near corners, and along/around curves. These are the areas where the pad isn't flat. The flat areas where I can move the pad along the panel seem to look pretty good. I don't understand how it is possible to get to curved areas without creating holograms.

Pretty frustrated and getting nervous that I am not going to be able to get the holograms out. Is it normal to have any holograms after using a swirl remover?

Is there any chance the holograms will be removed during the polishing process? Maybe I should use a softer pad during polishing? Using a yellow megs solo foam pad now.

ctrent86 · 09-17-09, 05:46

I think it wasn't broken down properly. Also, PO85RD with a blue pad make a good finishing combo. Just make sure you break it down enough.

McDougal · 09-17-09, 07:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctrent86

I think it wasn't broken down properly. Also, PO85RD with a blue pad make a good finishing combo. Just make sure you break it down enough.

My main questions right now are:

How will I know if it is broken down enough? Maybe I am too worried about doing too much. I would estimate that I am moving the pad over any particular spot 6-8 times, then spraying with water/alcohol, then increasing the speed of the buffer and another 6-8 passes.

I am using the megs yellow foam pad from their Solo line. Should I be using something different?

For newbies such as myself is it typical to have holograms after the swirl removal stage? Should I expect them to be taken care of during the polishing phase? I am going to use DG105. What is an OTC pad that would be a good choice for the polishing phase.

Possibly the most important thing. Is it in my best interest to scrap the Chicago Electric rotory and get something different that will make things easier? I think it might be in my best interest to just sack up and get a PC 7424. It sounds like this machine is easier to use with more room for error, and lesser chance for holograms and other mistakes. What is your take on this?

I would really appreciate answers or input on these questions.

slp123 · 09-18-09, 07:33

If you can, go get a PC, it is much easier to use in the last stage to remove micro-marring and holgrams left by the rotary.

Kepp the rotary for deep sratches and heavy swirls, but the PC will make it much easier and safer to remove the holograms on those corners.

McDougal · 09-18-09, 07:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by slp123

If you can, go get a PC, it is much easier to use in the last stage to remove micro-marring and holgrams left by the rotary.

Kepp the rotary for deep sratches and heavy swirls, but the PC will make it much easier and safer to remove the holograms on those corners.

Thanks for the advice. At this point I am probably just going to spend the extra money and get one.

EDIT: Western Tool has a PC 7436 (apparently the new model of the 7336) in stock for $145 with a backing plate so I am pretty sure I am going to pick it up soon.

Accumulator · 09-18-09, 10:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by McDougal

My main questions right now are:

How will I know if it is broken down enough? Maybe I am too worried about doing too much. I would estimate that I am moving the pad over any particular spot 6-8 times, then spraying with water/alcohol, then increasing the speed of the buffer and another 6-8 passes...

Extending the work time with the IPA/water mix would, IMO, make it *more* likely that you're overworking things. I'd just work the product until it's broken down (rough guide- almost dry), and buff off the residue. Run the speed up/down during the polish's normal work time.

IPA flashes kinda fast anyhow, and has zero lubricity, so I wouldn't be using it for that period.

Quote:

I am using the megs yellow foam pad from their Solo line. Should I be using something different?

Sorry, I dunno

I'm no rotary-Meister and I've never used the Solo pad.

Quote:

For newbies such as myself is it typical to have holograms after the swirl removal stage?

IMO it's not unusual for *anybody*. Plenty of good, experienced people still have them then. I know, I've removed holograms left by some very good pros.

Quote:

Should I expect them to be taken care of during the polishing phase? ...I think it might be in my best interest to just sack up and get a PC 7424...

I'd say to just get that (new model) PC and take care of 'em with that.