Gas: Full up or half a tank??? - Page 4

KnuckleBuckett · 01-04-08, 05:44

Pump readout feedback is calculated using the feedback port (kicks it off when full). The higher the speed the more that air in venturi form (zipping past the feedback port) increases readout error. In effect you are paying for air. Further, though to lesser effect, the higher the fill speed the more air is incorporated into the fuel (temporarily) thus again you are paying for air. An exagerated example of this would be whipped cream.

Deanski · 01-04-08, 05:54

Don't forget, todays gas now has 10% Ethanol which is VERY hydroscopic. Not a good thing. Even with this season blends, it's still Ethanol.

If you're going to store a car for winter, when level is about 1/2 tank, add Sta bil, then add gas to mix. Drive it long enough so it's in the fuel system. Make sure tank is full. Then you can proceed to the rest of winter prep.

Also, if after all your hard work cleaning/detailing the car including the underside, if you have a concrete floor, put a heavy plastic sheet down before rolling the car into the garage. Why? Moisture can wick-up and start rusting items. I also add mositure absorbing bags in the interior, trunk and engine areas.

The rest, battery maintainer, covers etc is up to you.

This is part of my prep before storage.

Deanski

KnuckleBuckett · 01-04-08, 06:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deanski

Don't forget, todays gas now has 10% Ethanol which is VERY hydroscopic. Not a good thing. Even with this season blends, it's still Ethanol.

Ethanol is also aproximately half the energy. Thus you are paying 2x for the ethanol part. It is a real rip off.

If you're going to store a car for winter, when level is about 1/2 tank, add Sta bil, then add gas to mix. Drive it long enough so it's in the fuel system. Make sure tank is full. Then you can proceed to the rest of winter prep.

Perfect!

Also, if after all your hard work cleaning/detailing the car including the underside, if you have a concrete floor, put a heavy plastic sheet down before rolling the car into the garage. Why? Moisture can wick-up and start rusting items. I also add mositure absorbing bags in the interior, trunk and engine areas.

On top of the plastic sheet, use cardboard, it wicks the remaining ambient moisture away from your car. Put a few open empty cardboard boxes in the seats, and trunk. In the engine compartment use flat cardboard. FYI keep cardboard onder lawnmowers, snowblowers, garden tools, and so on for the same reason.

The rest, battery maintainer, covers etc is up to you.

This is part of my prep before storage.

Deanski

Is it good practice to remove the battery?

What should be done to preserve tires?

truzoom · 01-04-08, 07:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnuckleBuckett

Pump readout feedback is calculated using the feedback port (kicks it off when full). The higher the speed the more that air in venturi form (zipping past the feedback port) increases readout error. In effect you are paying for air. Further, though to lesser effect, the higher the fill speed the more air is incorporated into the fuel (temporarily) thus again you are paying for air. An exagerated example of this would be whipped cream.

I think my brain just melted.

So is the main point that we should not lock the filler nozzle on that very last notch? Would I end up putting more gasoline into the tank if I filled it slower?

KnuckleBuckett · 01-04-08, 08:56

The SLOWER you pump the better.

truzoom · 01-04-08, 09:50

So if I pump fuel slower into the tank, there will be less air introduced, so my gauge reading should be more accurate?

KnuckleBuckett · 01-05-08, 04:29

Effectively, yes.

Deanski · 01-05-08, 05:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnuckleBuckett

Is it good practice to remove the battery?

What should be done to preserve tires?

Todays cars it may be a bad idea as many have computer related devices and by removing the battery, you run the risk of getting a fault that a dealer may have to clear.
As long as the battery is vented with a vent tube, leave it in the car and put a maintainer on it. Good ones will not boil the battery. Don't go cheap on the maintainer.

Inside, trunk, engine, add bags of desiccant and baking soda inside to pick-up odors and moisture. If you have rodents, check all places where they could enter and seal them. I also put steel wool or plastic on all engine openings (exhaust, intake etc). Mothballs in an old sock works well or peppermint oil in a container keeps them at bay.

Condition the body seals and rubber. Any good rubber conditioner. I use 1Z Gummi Pflege for rubber and Cockpit Premium for vinyl/plastic etc.

Tires: Increase tire pressure about 10-15 lbs above the recommended pressure and check every few weeks. Most cars are shipped with tires inflated very high, in my case 60Lbs. I also use Tire Cradles so the tires do not flat spot. Or roll (not start) the car a little every month. You can use a good rubber conditioner just to keep them clean.

Wheels, make sure ALL brake dust is off before storage and protect with wax or a sealant. Brake dust is corrosive.

I change the oil and filter before storage as well, it gets rid of additional moisture and acids from use that season. DO not start it when in storage. It just does not give the engine enough time to fully come to temp and burn off acids and other harmful agents. It also contaminates the nice clean oil you put in.

Once ready for start of the new season, I remove all blockages (wool, socks etc) check the car for rodents. Then, remove the fuel pump relay and crank the engine until you see oil pressure. Then re-install the relay and run at idle. Check for fluid leaks. Adjust tire pressure to correct settings. Brakes may not have the highest braking efficiency after long storage. Go easy and apply brakes several times at nice, low road speeds. Drive it below 3K/4K RPM until it's fully warm.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Deanski

Setec Astronomy · 01-05-08, 06:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deanski

Once ready for start of the new season...check the car for rodents.

This somehow conjured visions of Bill Murray from Caddyshack...

Aurora40 · 01-05-08, 07:40

I'm not quite sure I understand how air gets into a gas tank as the amount of gasoline goes down. I'd think the only time it gets in there is when you fill it? As the gas level goes down, fuel will vaporize to fill the void. I don't think rust is a problem anymore from low levels either, as most tanks have plastic liners.

I'd think the benefit of less weight is fairly trivial. We are talking maybe 50 lbs here, unless you are going to keep the tank at an 1/8 or less or something. Going to the gas station twice as often would seem to me like a pretty big negative for this scheme, though.

Setec Astronomy · 01-05-08, 08:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aurora40

I'm not quite sure I understand how air gets into a gas tank as the amount of gasoline goes down. I'd think the only time it gets in there is when you fill it? As the gas level goes down, fuel will vaporize to fill the void.

You're kidding, right? Oh...you're an electrical guy, IIRC. No, if you pull the gasoline out you're going to reduce the pressure in the tank to subatmospheric, simply because you are reducing the volume of the liquid in the tank. If you want to change the phase of the fluid as you suggest, you'll need to increase the temperature. Tank systems always have breather vents to equalize the tank pressure to atmospheric (within a certain tolerance) to account for liquid level changes and pressure changes caused by temperature changes. This prevents explosion or implosion of the tank, or overflowing, as well as providing a (relatively) constant suction pressure at the fuel pump. In the automotive application, the vapor recovery cannisters are hooked into this system to absorb the gasoline vapors.

It's the same principle as holding your finger over the end of a straw that's in a glass of liquid and pulling the straw out--as long as you keep your finger over the end of the straw the liquid will stay in there--but as you vent the tank by taking your finger off the end, the fluid will flow out...the same thing would happen in your gas tank if you didn't breathe air into there to replace the volume of gas being pumped out, the tank pressure would go subatmospheric (pulling a vacuum), the pump would cavitate (possibly damaging the impeller)...the car would stall from being fuel starved.

KnuckleBuckett · 01-05-08, 09:55

There is a web site that explains this and other such fuel trivia in detail. If I find it I will post it.