E-mail from a water [beading] specialist (sorta technical)

[YoSteve]

So yeah, I e-mailed a few universities to see what they had to say, about 2 weeks ago. I only got one response Coincidentally we were already having a discussion.

Dear Steve,
First, I have to say that you have sent me the most interesting water question that I have ever received. You are correct about both types of wax (all wax actually) being hydrophobic. Water molecules are polar, which means that each one has a negative end (the O) and a positive end (the H's). The polarity of water makes it a cohesive molecule, that is water molecules are attracted to other water molecules. Water also exhibits adhesive properties, which means water molecules are attracted to other (polar) molecules. You can see water's adhesive properties by
pouring it into a glass and looking very closely at the surface of the water where it meets the glass. You will see that the water rises up along the glass. It does this because the water molecules are adhering to the glass molecules.

Water molecules are not attracted to wax molecules, they don't adhere to each other. We call any substance that is not attracted to water hydrophobic. Wax, oil and soap are three common hydrophobic substances. Soap is extra special because not only does it not adhere to water, it also makes water less cohesive (less attractive to other water).

So what is the difference between the car wax that beads the water and the car wax that sheets the water? To know for sure exactly what is going on, we would have to know the ingredients in both types of wax. However, just by the reaction of the water, we know that the wax that sheets is more hydrophobic and appears to also disrupt the cohesion of the water. So it must contain something to do this that the beading wax does not contain.

Take care,
Marcy

Wow you would have thought that soap is not only hydrphobic but it futzes up water while it's at it, didn't know that.

So it's time for a new experient, take two test tubes coat them with K and Z (and other waxes) on the inside and fill them up with the same amount of water and measure their menisci (plural for meniscus: the curved upper surface of a column of liquid)

By measuring the the amount of water that creeps up the side of a test tube we can quantify (measure with numbers) the amount of adhesivity.

But yeah, if there is something in Klasse that actually affects the water then we should be able to see it. But it doesn't dispute the ability for Klasse to be hydrophobic.

[Yell00ITR]

Nice info, but not that technical. I dont remember basic PChem enough to differentiate between a hydrophobic chemical that causes beading versus sheeting. But, I did stumble across something interesting...another product that seems to have similar actions to Klasse...

Super Blue is an outstanding car, truck, metal & fiberglass polish. Here's a good way to see how well it will last when compared to other products. Apply to small areas of a horizontal surface on vehicles or equipment that will be subjected to repeat washings. At the outset, a good "beading" action will take place. The film will cure fully in a matter of days and become especially smooth as well as durable. The "beading" action will be replaced by a "sheeting" action. With water running off completely there is less chance of mineral/dirt settlement or the magnified effect of the sun's rays. These factors coupled with the film's toughness make SUPER BLUE last a lot longer than competitive products.

Snagged from: http://www.captphab.com/Info.html

[DETAILKING]

KLASSE and Zaino are not wax.....

[YoSteve]

I use the industry term wax for Klasse and Zaino.

Just because the e-mail spoke of waxes, it doesn't mean other non-waxes, like oil, and soap don't apply to beading (and not beading). Regardless the effects on water (our only choice) are what we look for since we do not have formulations for the two.

Otherwise we cannot "blame" Klasse for not beading, just as we cannot "praise" Zaino for beading, since if they are both not waxes we shouldn't even be having this long discussion.

[Arterion]

Webster's Revised Unabridged dictionary says:

Wax \Wax\, n. [AS. weax; akin to OFries. wax, D. was, G. wachs, OHG. wahs, Icel. & Sw. vax, Dan. vox, Lith. vaszkas, Russ. vosk'.] 1. A fatty, solid substance, produced by bees, and employed by them in the construction of their comb; -- usually called beeswax. It is first excreted, from a row of pouches along their sides, in the form of scales, which, being masticated and mixed with saliva, become whitened and tenacious. Its natural color is pale or dull yellow.

Note: Beeswax consists essentially of cerotic acid (constituting the more soluble part) and of myricyl palmitate (constituting the less soluble part).

2. Hence, any substance resembling beeswax in consistency or appearance. Specifically: (a) (Physiol.) Cerumen, or earwax. See Cerumen. (b) A waxlike composition used for uniting surfaces, for excluding air, and for other purposes; as, sealing wax, grafting wax, etching wax, etc.

I realize that Klasse is an acrylic, not natural carnuba wax. I'm not really sure what Zaino is exactly, but it's not a true "wax" either. However, both of these products could be considered "waxes" as they are both used to "wax" the car. If someone uses a synthetic "wax" (which is probably a polymer), they don't say "I'm going to polymer my car."

I suppose I'm saying that, while neither Zaino nor Klasse are literal waxes by the most specefic definition, they are waxes in the sense that you use them to "wax" the car.

The chemical makeup and application methods might differ somewhat from real wax, they both apply basically the same way (rub on, rub off) and they both serve the same purpose, to protect the car.

Are Klasse and Zaino carnuba waxes? No. Are they wax-like, and used for the same function as wax? Yes. Is it a misnomer to refer to them as "waxes" in the sense that they serve the same function as traditional waxes? I don't think so. Even our beloved sponser, Classic Motoring Accessories, markets Klasse under the "wax" section. I wonder why they'd do that?

Maybe because, by some definition, it is a wax.

[DETAILKING]

in making sense of all that gingerbread.....how do you explain KLASSE SG beading for a wash or two and then SHEETING?

[YoSteve]

extended cure time

and perhaps possible the washing away of the beading component

Klasse for me has always sheet/beaded not sheet only