Rock chip...with rust - Page 2

CocheseUGA · 10-21-09, 07:00

Wow, that Micromark site has outrageous shipping. Any chance of finding a fiberglass pencil locally? I was hoping to do this this weekend, but I had to put it off until the last minute to find the stuff.

Otherwise, I'm going to try the eraserhead technique with 200, 100 and 2000 grit.

Accumulator · 10-21-09, 08:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by CocheseUGA

Wow, that Micromark site has outrageous shipping. Any chance of finding a fiberglass pencil locally? I was hoping to do this this weekend, but I had to put it off until the last minute to find the stuff.

Otherwise, I'm going to try the eraserhead technique with 200, 100 and 2000 grit.

Eh...I never noticed the shipping at MicroMark

I only use them for stuff I can't find elsewhere and I guess that slipped my mind.

I've never found the fiberglass pencis locally.

Be careful with those really coarse grits of paper, you sure don't want to touch the surrounding paint with them. Anything you touch with coarser-than-2000 grit will probably be beyond fixing given the stuff you're planning to use.

Turbocress · 10-21-09, 09:34

to fix a rock chip that has rusted because it knocked away ALL the paint in that tiny area, your gonna need to sand the existing area down, remove a little more paint in that area, and sand the rust out completely before priming and painting again.

you can fix rock chips (tiny ones) if they simply removed clear or base coat and primer is still present, hell you could even put down more base, more clear (with a toothpick) and wet sand it out then buff it and see barely anything.

but if there is rust, i wouldnt risk trying to use a rust converter or simply "trying" to get all the rust with an eraser without removing more paint, rust goes underneath the paint around it, if its been there for more than a month rusting, even a tiny amount of rust left is gonna keep forming under the paint... thats why they call it cancer, get it all or dont bother.

CocheseUGA · 10-21-09, 09:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Accumulator

Eh...I never noticed the shipping at MicroMark

I only use them for stuff I can't find elsewhere and I guess that slipped my mind.

I've never found the fiberglass pencis locally.

Be careful with those really coarse grits of paper, you sure don't want to touch the surrounding paint with them. Anything you touch with coarser-than-2000 grit will probably be beyond fixing given the stuff you're planning to use.

Oh yeah, I know. I'll have to be super careful. If I can get it to look like just another chip, I'll be happy. I'm probably going to need a repaint in a couple of years anyway, especially at 30k a year.

Accumulator · 10-21-09, 10:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbocress

..but if there is rust, i wouldnt risk trying to use a rust converter or simply "trying" to get all the rust with an eraser without removing more paint, rust goes underneath the paint around it, if its been there for more than a month rusting, even a tiny amount of rust left is gonna keep forming under the paint... thats why they call it cancer, get it all or dont bother.

Eh, not to be all

but I've done this *so* many times with great results that I can't agree with you. After *years* of use my previously rusted, touched up chips/etc. have stayed OK.

Some rust converters really are capable of stopping minor rust in its tracks, and Rust Encapsulator is one *VERY* impressive product, not like the old POR-15 stuff that has disappointed so many people.

Latest thoughts- I saw touchup paint (in the Herrington catalog, somebody else has gotta have it...) that's acrylic-enamel. That oughta work *great* over Eastwood's Rust Encapsulator. Rust converter, followed by Rust Encapsulator as the primer, topped with that enamel based touchup paint oughta work fine. It won't have clearcoat, so it won't be a 100% match in every regard, but touch ups seldom are anyhow.

Turbocress · 10-21-09, 05:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Accumulator

Eh, not to be all

but I've done this *so* many times with great results that I can't agree with you. After *years* of use my previously rusted, touched up chips/etc. have stayed OK.

Some rust converters really are capable of stopping minor rust in its tracks, and Rust Encapsulator is one *VERY* impressive product, not like the old POR-15 stuff that has disappointed so many people.

Latest thoughts- I saw touchup paint (in the Herrington catalog, somebody else has gotta have it...) that's acrylic-enamel. That oughta work *great* over Eastwood's Rust Encapsulator. Rust converter, followed by Rust Encapsulator as the primer, topped with that enamel based touchup paint oughta work fine. It won't have clearcoat, so it won't be a 100% match in every regard, but touch ups seldom are anyhow.

well, it all depends on how long the rust has been there, but if someone is worried enough to touch it up, chances are they caught it early enough that it didnt spread under the paint adjacent to it being such a small spot.

some rust converters do actually work, and one i found that worked good just to note, is naval jelly. ive used por 15 before, but the stuff seems to work only if you do the most absolute perfect preparation which is near to impossible unless you live and breath cleaning chemicals and live in a perfect environment

Accumulator · 10-22-09, 09:50

Turbocress- Yeah, no matter what the method, you do have to get to all the rust. Sometimes that can involve disrupting the surrounding paint, and you sure gotta be careful about how you do that or you'll open a whole new can of worms.

I haven't used Navel Jelly since forever, I bet they've reformulated it a few times since then.

The best rust converter I've ever used was sold by 3M and was called "Rust Avenger". Notice my use of past-tense, they discontinued it

I have enough to last me a good long time, but so far I haven't found anything quite as good (the current version of Eastwood's stuff isn't *bad* but it's not as good either).

Yeah, POR-15 sure can be finicky. I guess that's part of why I'm so astounded by the Rust Encapsulator; it really works the way the ad-copy for such products says it should. I actually did well with POR-15, never had one problem, but I've known/seen so many cases where other people *did* have problems that I just can't recommend it.

Turbocress · 10-22-09, 11:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Accumulator

Turbocress- Yeah, no matter what the method, you do have to get to all the rust. Sometimes that can involve disrupting the surrounding paint, and you sure gotta be careful about how you do that or you'll open a whole new can of worms.

I haven't used Navel Jelly since forever, I bet they've reformulated it a few times since then.

The best rust converter I've ever used was sold by 3M and was called "Rust Avenger". Notice my use of past-tense, they discontinued it

I have enough to last me a good long time, but so far I haven't found anything quite as good (the current version of Eastwood's stuff isn't *bad* but it's not as good either).

Yeah, POR-15 sure can be finicky. I guess that's part of why I'm so astounded by the Rust Encapsulator; it really works the way the ad-copy for such products says it should. I actually did well with POR-15, never had one problem, but I've known/seen so many cases where other people *did* have problems that I just can't recommend it.

well, its pretty funny, because it seems that if you skip a single step of the proper preparation of applying por 15, it will flake off in large sheets. ive seen applications of por 15 that you could smack with a sledgehammer and it wont chip, it pretty much bonds with the surface like no other.... but if there is a single molecule of dust, dirt, grease, or oil on the surface, and you dont use their prep solvent or a similar high quality one, and really do a good job cleaning it up beforehand, then its gonna break off in sheets heh.

the naval jelly ive used worked pretty damn well... used a single bottle of it to de-rust almost half of a truck bed, 15-20 minutes of setting on there and you can easily see it change color, doesnt even turn it black. all the auto parts stores carry it, and it worked real well for me when i was doing a restoration.

CocheseUGA · 10-23-09, 04:37

Ordering paint - should I go with paintscratch.com?

Accumulator · 10-23-09, 06:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by CocheseUGA

Ordering paint - should I go with paintscratch.com?

There, or Automotive Touchup dot com (something like that anyhow..). Unless you do decide to do the Rust Encapsulator, in which case I'd look for something enamel-based (search on "herrington").

No matter who you go with, it's always hit-or-miss IME regarding how well it'll match; sometimes it's great, sometimes it's awful, and now and then it's in-between...purely a crap-shoot.

CocheseUGA · 10-23-09, 06:30

Thanks for all your help so far. I hope to get this stuff in time for next weekend.

CocheseUGA · 11-04-09, 05:50

OK, I finally got around to ordering my touch-up paint, and I think I'm going to bite the bullet and get the pen from MicroMark and do it right.

There is one thing that I'm still concerned with - the rust encapsulator. I looked on Eastwood's site, and AFAICT, they only sell it in an aerosol. I don't think I'm good enough to use a spray without it going everywhere. And I don't need a quart, probably only an ounce or so. I was going to use the toothpick method in all phases. The only thing I've found so far is Plasti-kote Rust Not converter. Mar-Hyde looks like it's available by the pint, too, as are several others that I've not heard of before on Amazon. I'm not opposed to using the Eastwood product, but buying a quart seems like huge overkill. I've no plans to treat any frames.

I ordered the primer with my paint, so no worries there. The other question I have is if I remove the rust with the pen, is the converter needed for any rust I can't see, or those microscopic specks of rust 'dust' that I might leave behind?