Prep with Kerosene ??? - Page 3

Accumulator · 10-25-09, 10:08

94BlkStang- Thanks for the additional info. My dad got the Stoddard Solvent from the company he worked for so I knew it was "the real Stoddard Solvent" since well, he was certainly able to read what was on the tank and this co. woulda been pretty specific about what products it was using for what. No surprise that the same stuff was used for various things under various names though.

Yeah, unlike WD-40, Stoddard Solvent flashed clean, utterly different.

Any specific caveats about the aromatic-solvent version of 3M Adhesive Remover? I use that stuff almost as much as my dad used the Stoddard! Very handy stuff, and I've never had it damage anything *yet* (famous last words, huh?).

94BlkStang · 10-25-09, 12:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Accumulator

94BlkStang- Thanks for the additional info. My dad got the Stoddard Solvent from the company he worked for so I knew it was "the real Stoddard Solvent" since well, he was certainly able to read what was on the tank and this co. woulda been pretty specific about what products it was using for what. No surprise that the same stuff was used for various things under various names though.

Yeah, unlike WD-40, Stoddard Solvent flashed clean, utterly different.

Any specific caveats about the aromatic-solvent version of 3M Adhesive Remover? I use that stuff almost as much as my dad used the Stoddard! Very handy stuff, and I've never had it damage anything *yet* (famous last words, huh?).

Like any product some testing should be done in an inconspicuous area to see how it reacts to certain materials, but as far as cured paint, it won't bother it all except for stripping any wax, but a quick rewax of the area you're good to go. I would avoid contact with any plastic trim, rubber or decals as it could do some damage to them.

Accumulator · 10-26-09, 08:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94BlkStang

Like any product some testing should be done in an inconspicuous area to see how it reacts to certain materials, but as far as cured paint, it won't bother it all except for stripping any wax, but a quick rewax of the area you're good to go. I would avoid contact with any plastic trim, rubber or decals as it could do some damage to them.

OK, just wondered if you knew of any specific potential issues.

I've done very well with it on plastics (hey, the factory cap/spout are plastic), never dried any out though it still gives me pause sometimes.

I'm pretty careful about using it on rubber (though I have used it to remove some tenacious adhesives from tires), limiting the dwell time.

Yeah, it removes decals quite effectively and it strips wax really well. Heh heh, let's hope such instances are intentional

David Fermani · 10-26-09, 03:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94BlkStang

curious what solvents you refer to and what makes kerosene so nasty? Do you also realize that there are different grade levels of kerosene? There are a few manufactures of very highly refined products that are classified as kerosene as it's mainly determined by the flash point and distilation range of the product and typically very low odor or no odor. No different really than mineral spirits but just a higfher flash point (typcially around 160 or more) and end point (typically around 450) where mineral spirtis are 120 to 142 flash point and end point of 390's to low 400's. Kerosene (the low odor and highly refines kind) can be a very good and safe cleaner. I will agree that it is one of the slower solvents available but that's what makes it somewhat safer also.

The Kerosenes I've used are usually slowing working/evaporating (which can be good for some heavy tar removals), usually pretty weak compared to other solvents (New Car solvents / Thinners) leave a greasy/oily residue behind and have a nasty odor that sticks up your shop/garage. Out of all the chemical suppliers I've followed, none ever offer/prescribe any formulation of kerosene?

My all time favorite solvent is Goof Off, but because it contains Xylene & Benzene, I now avoid it.

I see you're well versed in solvents. What's your take on solvents containing Xylene, Benzene or Toluene? Yeh or nay?

Care to give us a recommendation on a strong solvent that is paint safe and won't kill you? Or maybe one for interiors and another for exteriors.

94BlkStang · 10-26-09, 05:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Fermani

The Kerosenes I've used are usually slowing working/evaporating (which can be good for some heavy tar removals), usually pretty weak compared to other solvents (New Car solvents / Thinners) leave a greasy/oily residue behind and have a nasty odor that sticks up your shop/garage. Out of all the chemical suppliers I've followed, none ever offer/prescribe any formulation of kerosene?

My all time favorite solvent is Goof Off, but because it contains Xylene & Benzene, I now avoid it.

I see you're well versed in solvents. What's your take on solvents containing Xylene, Benzene or Toluene? Yeh or nay?

Care to give us a recommendation on a strong solvent that is paint safe and won't kill you? Or maybe one for interiors and another for exteriors.

Hi David. Yes Kerosene is a very slow drying solvent and one of the least aggressive as that's why I was trying to get clariffication as to what makes it so nasty to you. Many companies lable Diesel#1 as kerosene and can be pretty tangy and obnoxious smelling but the kerosene I was referring to is what they call an odorless kerosene and pretty much smells a lot like minerals spirits. They tend to have a little more odor to them because they don't dry and evaporate as fast. Toluene is much stronger odor but goes away quickly when it evaporates.

Toluene and Xylene are excellent products but do have some hazards that go along with them as they are considered toxins but the amount a detailer would use I would consider not even an issue as long as they are used in a well ventilated area and away from flames. If you want to make a pretty good cleaner then mix it 60/40 where the Toluene mixes well with lantern fuel (it's actually called rubber solvent in many industries) and xylene with mineral spirits. They won't be quite as aggressive but makes them also a little less potent and user friendly.

Over the last 7 or 8 years the terpenes have really become more popular. They are much more expensive but do a pretty good job and much safer to use and the D'Limonene (orange extract terpene) based cleaners smell like oranges (don't drink it, lol) so it makes it much more pleasant to use. There are a ton of products on the market that now use this product in their cleaners.

All in all unless you are using a heavy dose of any solvent they should be safe to use in moderate amounts in car detailing.

By the way, benzene has been illegal for quite some time but it's also a byproduct (extremely small amount) of the aromatic solvents (toluene and xylene) so it's impossible to avoid it completely when using those products and why it's usually listed in an MSDS that contain those products.

wannafbody · 10-26-09, 06:33

I'd avoid Benzene like the plague-it's linked to cancer.

94BlkStang · 10-26-09, 07:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by wannafbody

I'd avoid Benzene like the plague-it's linked to cancer.

Like I said, Benzene doesn't even exist in the market place as a solvent anymore and hasn't been for some time but the low level amounts found in the aromatic solvents isn't of any consequences as those products are not labeled as carcinogens.

MDRX8 · 10-27-09, 04:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94BlkStang

Like I said, Benzene doesn't even exist in the market place as a solvent anymore and hasn't been for some time but the low level amounts found in the aromatic solvents isn't of any consequences as those products are not labeled as carcinogens.

So would Kerosene be alright to use?

94BlkStang · 10-27-09, 06:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by MDRX8

So would Kerosene be alright to use?

Yes, it's a relatively safe solvent to use as it contains no benzenes and is as safe to use as mineral spirits is. There are some available that are called "odorless" kerosene and that's what I would advise using if a kerosene is the choice of products to use as some of the lower grades can have a much more pungent odor like diesel fuel. Like was mentioned in a previous post, it is a very slow drying solvent and can leave a residue.

JimmyCutlass · 10-27-09, 06:26

I use Meg's detailer line Body Solvent.

jfelbab · 10-27-09, 06:31

Dupont Prepsol is also very good.

TrueDetailer · 10-27-09, 08:02

Talk about way old school.

I learned to detail from a few old school guys at a big dealership. I learned so much from them guys. Alot of old school ways are frowned upon now adays.

One reason being the amount of products on the market now that can do about the same thing with alot less of the risk. Another one imo, all the online communities with closed minded newbs to the business with their new ways of doing things.

What you don't relize though, 30-40 years ago there wasn't a big market for detailing. You had to use what you had available. If you could make it work for what you needed, you used it.

I've used keroseen before, like i said i learned from old school guys. They tought me everything they knew and everything i now know.