Should the government bail-out include domestic automakers?

[MotorCity]

Originally Posted by SamIam

The fact that the CEO's are showing up on private jets, costing $20K to fly them toWashington, where they are asking the government to write them a blank check, leaves me speechless. .

I would have to agree with you

Rep. Henry Waxman, D-Calif., has unseated Rep. John Dingell, D-Mich., longtime auto industry ally in Congress, as chairman of the powerful House Energy and Commerce Committee, which handles much industry-related legislation. MORE TO COME

This cant be good for us

[Len_A]

Originally Posted by MotorCity

I would have to agree with you




This cant be good for us

no kidding

[MotorCity]

Compromise reached in Senate on auto bailout

AUTOMOTIVE NEWS
12:48 pm U.S. ET | Nov. 20


Key members of the U.S. Senate have reached a bipartisan deal to fund a rescue package for the Detroit 3, according to a spokesman for U.S. Sen. Carl Levin. It remains unclear whether the senators have enough votes or when the matter will be taken up. It's also unclear if Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., has signed on to the compromise. A draft of the compromise was being worked on by Levin, D-Mich., and Sen. Christopher Bond, R-Mo., among others

Bond and Sen. George Voinovich, R-Ohio, with White House support, on Wednesday introduced legislation that would redirect $25 billion in loans to the auto industry as bridge loans to the Detroit 3 automakers. The original intent of the loans was to enable automakers and suppliers to retool to build more fuel-efficient vehicles.

Democratic leaders in Congress have resisted using those funds, instead seeking money from the recently approved $700 billion banking bailout legislation.

Levin and other auto state senators are expected to reveal terms of the compromise at a 2:30 p.m. press conference today on Capitol Hill.

There was no word about any similar activity in the House of Representatives.

The CEOs of the Detroit 3 are asking for $25 billion in federal funds to see the automakers through a cash crisis.

Still many hurdles

Even with a deal among Senate negotiators, the legislation faces hurdles. There would have to be agreement among all 100 senators, which is rare, to allow the bill to come to a quick vote in the Senate.

If that agreement is not reached, the earliest a vote might come is on Saturday and it was unclear if lawmakers would stay in Washington that long ahead of the Nov. 27 Thanksgiving holiday.

Plus, any bill likely would need at least 60 votes to overcome anticipated procedural hurdles by opponents.

Also unclear is whether the House of Representatives would stay in session late this week.

Another possibility is a vote on an auto bill sometime after the Thanksgiving holiday. Earlier this week, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi ruled out a post-holiday session. But Reid said he would talk to Pelosi later today about having another short work session.

Reid and Pelosi are scheduled to meet later today to discuss timing of legislation.

House Democratic support is crucial for passing any compromise.

[Len_A]

From MarketWatch.com (LINK HERE} ):

Aid plan for Big Three falters in Congress
Senate Majority Leader says auto companies need to submit a plan


By Robert Schroeder, MarketWatch
Last update: 2:46 p.m. EST Nov. 20, 2008
Comments: 432
WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) -- Democratic leaders said Thursday there is no deal on aid yet for the Big Three U.S. automakers, and asked the chief executives of those companies to return to Congress with concrete plans on how they would use federal funds to turn their companies around before getting any money from Washington.
"Until they show us the plan, we cannot show them the money," said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., at a press conference.

GM 2.96, +0.17, +6.1%) and Chrysler LLC should submit a plan by Dec. 2. Reid said Congress would return the week of Dec. 8 if lawmakers get plans from the automakers that would return viability and sustainability to the industry.
The Democratic leaders spoke after a small bipartisan group of lawmakers reached a deal among themselves to buoy the industry.
But Reid said there weren't enough votes in the Senate or House to pass that compromise.

"Unfortunately, the sad reality is that no one has come up with a plan that can pass the House and the Senate and get signed by President Bush," said Reid.

Democrats have sought $25 billion in new loans for Ford, General Motors and Chrysler, but the White House and Republicans want the Big Three to tap into a previously approved $25 billion Energy Department loan program aimed at helping the companies retool.

[MotorCity]

Bailout compromise plan put on ice, but hope remains

Harry Stoffer
Automotive News
November 20, 2008 - 12:48 pm ET
UPDATED: 11/20/08 2:50 p.m. EST


WASHINGTON -- Democratic leaders of Congress today rejected a proposed bipartisan compromise that would have provided $25 billion in emergency federal aid to the Detroit 3.

Sens. Carl Levin and Debbie Stabenow, both Michigan Democrats, announced this afternoon that they were signing onto a Republican proposal to redirect $25 billion in loans aimed at helping automakers build more fuel-efficient vehicles. Instead, those funds would provide bridge loans to the Detroit 3 to help them address fiscal crises.

But before a news conference announcing that compromise, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., and seven other Democratic leaders entered the room in which the event was to be held. They said they did not support the proposal.

"It's their agreement," Reid said of the compromise's supporters.

During an afternoon news conference, Levin and other compromise supporters said they were pleased with developing a bipartisan plan and said they still were hopeful a deal could be completed in December.

Democratic leaders support carving out $25 billion in loans to the Detroit 3 from the $700 billion federal bailout fund for financial institutions. President George W. Bush and GOP lawmakers have rejected that approach.

Reid said the CEOs of the Detroit 3, who testified before House and Senate committees this week, did not convince Congress that their companies could be made viable with additional aid.

He said he would ask the automakers to submit plans by Dec. 2 detailing how they would use more federal money. Reid said he would look for "accountability and viability."

Added Pelosi: "Until they show us a plan, we can't show them the money."

The Senate Banking Committee and House Financial Services Committee, which held this week's hearings, would hold further hearings the week of Dec. 8 to consider the Detroit 3 plans, Reid said. After that, he said, the full House and Senate could consider further aid legislation.

While Pelosi also expressed doubt that further federal aid would make the Detroit 3 viable, she rejected suggestions that the companies should file for bankruptcy protection.

[Len_A]

A lot was made, by the media and others, about the use of private luxury jets by the CEO's of GM, Ford, and Chrysler. While acknowledging the boneheaded move by the Detroit Three's CEO's, in flying to Washington, DC in three separate corporate luxury jets, to make their case for a bridge loan I want to point something out:

As previously noted by some in the media, the Lehman Brother/AIG clowns haven't given up their fleet of private jets either, nor were they taken to task over flying to DC in their jets, when testifying before Congress. And don't forget the "distinguished" members of Congress who b*tched about the private jets, are part of a group of elected officials, who as a group, regularly fly on junkets, aboard the Air Force's fleet of Lear/Bombardier/Gulfstream luxury jets, while racking up their eligibility for the nations best retiree health care and pensions. All courtesy of the American taxpayer. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

And to make political points, they're willing to risk the futures of the millions of us who depend on the Big Three. Including guys like me.

[Setec Astronomy]

Yeah, the whole private jet thing was a little ridiculous. I may not think that the CEO's should be making anywhere near the salaries they do, but they still are the CEO's of multi-billion dollar companies and deserve to fly on the corporate jet; their time is valuable.

Besides, no one in congress complains about their CEO (W.) flying around on his private jet when the country is $10 trillion in debt.

[MSOsr]

Originally Posted by Setec Astronomy

Besides, no one in congress complains about their CEO (W.) flying around on his private jet when the country is $10 trillion in debt.

I think Air Force One is used for security purposes, not as a luxury. DUH!

Mike

[Len_A]

Originally Posted by Setec Astronomy

Yeah, the whole private jet thing was a little ridiculous. I may not think that the CEO's should be making anywhere near the salaries they do, but they still are the CEO's of multi-billion dollar companies and deserve to fly on the corporate jet; their time is valuable.

Besides, no one in congress complains about their CEO (W.) flying around on his private jet when the country is $10 trillion in debt.

The Detroit CEO's could have learned form the example of UAW president Ron Gettelfinger - not only does he fly commercial, he flies coach.

Originally Posted by MSOsr

I think Air Force One is used for security purposes, not as a luxury. DUH!

Mike

True for the President, but what about Congress regularly flying around on the Air Force's fleet of business jets (i.e. private jets - Lear/Bombardier/Gulfstream luxury jets)? On junkets that are supposed to be for Congressional business, but they take their spouses and/or other family members for vacations (that are "tacked" on to teh "fact finding" trips). With you and me footing the bill.

[Setec Astronomy]

Originally Posted by MSOsr

I think Air Force One is used for security purposes, not as a luxury. DUH!

Sure, but it's also for speed and convenience. The president is a busy guy, and so is the CEO of a multi-billion dollar corp. These companies are in trouble; if I was an employee or a stockholder, I'd want the CEO working on the problems, not standing on line two hours beforehand getting asked if anyone else packed his suitcase (and probably someone did, at least his wife...and then he would have been late to the congressional grilling because he was getting cavity-searched by the TSA).

[AeroCleanse]

Of course they should not bail out the car companies. If you can't make a product that competes, why should the government bail you out of your mistakes.

[Mr. Clean]

Following the recent events, I am growing more convinced that a government bailout of Detroit automakers is not a good idea. The so-called leaders of these groups show up asking for money in corporate jets and no detailed plans for how/what/when/where these funds will be used to turn these companies into profit centers. Their actions showed blatant arrogance and incompetence; not anything that should instill confidence in legislators and taxpayers that these funds would be repayed at all, much less in a timely fashion.

Isn't Chrysler now a privately owned company (Cerberus Capital)? Should the government be considering bailing out a privately held auto manufacturer? One which has already been bailed out once by the taxpayers.