Autopia.org - #1 auto detailing forum for car enthusiasts and professional detailers.
Autopia.org Articles, Editorial & Blogs for Car Detailing Enthusiasts Autopia Reviews: Auto Detailing Car Wax, Polish, Cleaner, Protectant Reviews Detailing Products & Supplies Catalog
Go Back   Autopia.org > THE CLUB HOUSE > SPONSOR FORUMS > Autogeek.net


Welcome to Autopia.org.


You are viewing as a guest.  By joining our FREE community you will be able to interact with others.  Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today.   When you join, this box is replaced with our live chat!

Autopia Marketplace

Reply
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes

Old 10-15-09, 08:54   #1 (permalink)
Director of Training
 
Mike Phillips's Avatar
 
Mike Phillips is offline
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Stuart, Florida
Posts: 1,377
The power in the after shots is created in the before shots

The power in the after shots is created in the before shots

In my life I've had the good fortune to work on a lot of cool cars and with a lot of cool people for which I'm always very thankful for. I've also had the good fortune to work on a lot of very neglected cars, some special interest and some not but to the owner it was alway important and when it's important to the owner then it's important to me.

One of the things I've learned when doing dramatic extreme makeovers, whether on oxidized single stage paints or swirled-out clear coats, is the importance of capturing great before shots.

One of the biggest problems with capturing a great before shot is someone, not understanding the value in the before shot and all it's ugliness, will take some kind of paint polishing product and make a clean, shiny spot in an otherwise really neglected and ugly panel like the hood or the trunk-lid. These types of panels make the best before and after shots because they are usually large, they are usually in the worst shape, you can look down on them, or in this case take an overhead shot of them, and the hood is specifically the panel that gets the most attention from car enthusiasts.

So over the years when I've discussed doing future extreme makeovers on project cars with the owners I've always stressed the importance of not touching the paint till AFTER we get the before shots.

It's just so uncanny that if you don't bring this topic up, then sometime before you arrive at the car's location or the car is brought to your location, someone and their good intentions will do you the favor of rubbing something smack dab in the middle of the hood and make a shiny spot and ruin the before pictures.

Anyway, a couple of years ago while scheduling an Extreme Makeover, I wrote this little sentence that I think states the concept very clearly and wanted to post it in it's own thread with a time stamp for others to learn from and hopefully explain the "why" behind the idea...

So here it is and you can quote me on this,

Quote:
"If you ever do an extreme makeover on a car or some other project, remember the power in the after shots is created in the before shots"

So do your best to get GREAT before shots before bringing your hand or your polisher down onto the paint and making a shiny spot. And try to educate the owner if there's going to be time passing before the project is scheduled to also not take any action until after the before shots area captured. Just as a precaution. Better safe than sorry.


Often times I'll see a great write-up on a spectacular and dramatic before and after project and the detailer will say something like,

"Sorry I didn't get any before pictures"

This happens all the time. It's happened to me because I didn't have a camera handy or the batteries were dead.

So just a note to anyone reading this, if you ever do an extreme makeover on something cool or special interest, remember, the power is in the before pictures, so make plans to capture them before buffing on the car.



Here's an example,

I met this gentleman at our local Autozone and mentioned to him that his car was a great candidate for an extreme makeover; explained the process and gave him my phone number and in our conversation I let him know the importance of not making a shiny spot on the hood.

I figured like most people he'll never call. A few months later this guy calls me and reminds me of the car and asks if I still want to use it for an extreme makeover? Let's me know he's going to take his Dad along for an upcoming car cruise and car show.

I asked him,

Have you worked on it at all?

He said no

So I said, bring it on over and we'll buff it out till it shines like a diamond, which he did. Anyway, it's just a nice old Ford and it was fun to polish out. I was just happy he didn't rub some kind of compound in the middle of the hood in the months between when I met him at Autozone and the day he brought it over.

He purchased this 1960 Ford Ranchero off eBay in running condition for $900.00 and has been tinkering on it in his spare time while using it as a daily driver back and forth to the cement plant where he works. So the paint sits out in the Mojave Desert sun and bakes with a coating of all kinds of dust from the cement plant landing on it.

Before


One half covered and taped-off


Before and after results


After




A few more from this Extreme Makeover












From the back...










Some more of the hood,













The roof was white in some places due to extreme oxidation.





Note the problem with modern clear coats is swirls while the problem with older single stage paints is oxidation. It's not that modern clear coats won't oxidize it's just that process takes a lot longer and the more visual and noticeable problem is swirls.

I took over a hundred pictures, here's a few more random shots...




















One of the problems most detailers run into when taking before and after pictures is that projects like this take all day, that is the machine compounding, polishing and waxing usually takes anywhere from 6 to 14 hours depending upon how bad the paint is, how fast you are at what you do and how important the project it.

If the project is very important most detailers will slow down and pay more attention to each square inch as they polish the paint to perfection. A production detailer can buff out a car about as fast as they can walk around the car so there's a wide spectrum as to how much time a buff-out like the above will take and a lot of it depends upon the detailer. I think I had about 6-7 hours into this project and the owner helped throughout the process except for the rotary buffer steps.

Normally we would reach for M80 Speed Glaze as it will usually do a good job of chewing off the dead, oxidized paint from a single stage finish when used with a wool pad and a rotary buffer while gorging the paint with same type of polishing oils found in M07 but instead we used M105 with a rotary buffer and a wool cutting pad followed by M205 using a W-8000 foam polishing pad on a rotary buffer and it worked like a charm.

We did the optional step of re-polishing the single stage paint using M07 Show Car Glaze to really gorge the paint with the high concentration of polishing oils found in M07 and then sealed the paint using NXT Tech Wax Paste version 1.0 (That's what I had in the garage).

After we got into it the owner commented how he wasn't aware how involved we were going to get as he thought we were just going to wax it.


Products Used
M105/W5500/RB - 1500 RPM
M205/W-8000/RB - 1500 RPM
M07/W-8006/DA - 5.0 Speed Setting
NXT/W9207/DA - 4.0 Speed Setting


Friendly suggestion...
Anytime you find yourself in a position to buff out something interesting or unique, do your best to get the before pictures. While the after pictures make the car look its best, it's the before pictures that show how you took a diamond in the rough and turned it into a glistening gemstone.


__________________
Mike Phillips
Director of Training
1-800-869-3011 x206
Mike.Phillips@Autogeek.net

"Find something you like and use it often"
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Old 10-15-09, 09:08   #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
5spdfrk is offline
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 50
Re: The power in the after shots is created in the before shots

Nice write-up! I completely agree!
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Old 10-15-09, 09:17   #3 (permalink)
U Bring It - I Bling It
 
David Fermani's Avatar
 
David Fermani is offline
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: S. Florida
Posts: 4,514
Re: The power in the after shots is created in the before shots

Nice to see you throwing some posts on here Mike!
Yeah, I've seen alot of great write ups on various forums and it's always a plus to show the audience what you ackompished through some nice before & after shots. What looses my attention is where there way too many. Do we really need 20+ before shots of swirled up paint to get the whole picture of the car's condition? I also see various after pictures just showing reflections of their garage ceiling. It shows us nothing worth while either. I wish we could all have Pro photographers taking our pictures, but we're detailers doing what we know best I guess.
__________________
The Perfection is in the Reflection

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoudyL
If you are experienced enough to be able to argue with my points, then my advice probably doesn't apply to you.
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Old 10-15-09, 09:44   #4 (permalink)
Proper prep is a virtue
 
howareb's Avatar
 
howareb is offline
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Stafford, VA.
Posts: 1,393
Contact: Send a message via Yahoo to howareb
Re: The power in the after shots is created in the before shots

Mike, great write up.
Should be a sticky. (HEHE)


I am in total agreement with you on this from experience. I cannot tell you how many times I could kick myself because I did not take any before pics.
__________________
Mint Auto Detailing LLC
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Old 10-15-09, 10:20   #5 (permalink)
Now with twice the head
 
Scottwax's Avatar
 
Scottwax is offline
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 27,391
Contact: Send a message via AIM to Scottwax
Re: The power in the after shots is created in the before shots

Speaking as a pro, my primary objective is to do a quality detail for my paying customer. Sometimes that means little to no pictures if the customer is on a tight schedule. Just comes with the territory. Other times, the weather does not cooperate, the sun pops out so inconsistently or seldom you can't get good before or afters, or the job takes so long the lighting is completely different from when you started. That's just the nature of the business when you are mobile.

I do try to take as many good shots as possible when time and lighting conditions permit. However, I do try not to overwhelm the thread with 50 before/after shots. I figure 4-6 befores and 4-6 afters get the point across. Heavily swirled or oxidized paint makes the best comparisons, IMO.

I agree with David about the overabundance of befores followed by afters with completely different (and IMO intentional) lighting that don't show for sure that the defects were actually removed. The shots you (Mike) posted leave no doubt.

I do think this turned out to be my most dramatic before and after. I had brought my lights with me and the owner expected me to be there all day so time wasn't an issue. I tried to make sure the pictures were as close to each other in framing as possible (didn't move the lights) but forgot to zoom in as much in the after shot.



__________________
Scott's Mobile Auto Detailing
I test for Optimum, Clearkote, Meguiars
Washing with ONR video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYOAyxsEIuQ
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
POWER Waterless Auto Washer... On The Cheap DavidB High Definition Car Care 153 10-30-09 08:35
Would this car inverter suffice to power my pc for a full detailing session fliplyricist1 Car Detailing 11 04-03-08 07:24
Some more CMA Orange Power Pad ?'s 1badtaco Car Detailing 6 08-10-03 07:07
Water, Power and waiting edschwab1 Professional Detailer General Discussion 4 05-07-03 09:39
Replacing power antenna with non power?? kgb Exterior & Performance 0 04-23-03 11:28



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:14.


Copyright (c), 1999-2009, Autopia.org - All Rights Reserved

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.1.0

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65