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Originally Posted by billium
Len, re-read my post. The Dakota was a NEW leftover (unsold previous year model). I believe it had less than 5 miles on the odometer when I picked it up and it came with the full factory warranty.
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I stand corrected. Sorry to hear that. I've owned nothing but Ford's, except for one company car a few years ago from GM. We routinely put over 120,000 on our cars before I trade them in. Some have had some problems, but recent model years go by, problems
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Originally Posted by billium
But you're correct with your "unfortunate" comment. "Unfortunate" for me to have the same experience with the Dakota that I had years earlier with Detroit's offerings. Not just the quality of product issues, but the same cavalier response from a dealership to my problems. "Unfortunate" for GM, Ford and Chrysler that I don't believe in "third" chances, regardless how cheaply they offer their product or what rebates/incentives are offered. "Unfortunate" for these same three manufacturers that both of our kids are in the market for new cars in the next 6 months. Neither are considering any Detroit products.
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Dealers are independent business people, and caviler attitudes toward customers aren't only the the purview of the Detroit 3 dealers, and bigoted as hell to imply or say that. As any Toyota owner who had engine problems due to oil sludge (something that affected models from Corolla to Lexus LS), and the caviler way dealers blew them off with charges of owner abuse, even when owners had receipt records of oil changes. Lot's of other problems that non-Detroit dealers have had with their customers too, and it doesn't more than two or three minutes with Yahoo or Google to find them.
Toyota Engine Problems Link and
Brake Problems Link Here and
Highlander problems here
Honda transmission problems here and
more tranny problems here and
transmission failure here
Nissan Problems here and
more Nissan Problems here and
Nissan Titan Frame Problems Here
That took all of five minutes. All auto makers have problems. My wife is a paralegal who on processing discovery requests for one Detroit auto maker's law suits. She has access to NHTSA's information on recalls. Guess what - all automakers have investigations going against them. All auto maker dealers have problem children who mistreat customers. Your bad problems and everyone else on this board who have complaints are your experiences, but proof of an absolute fact.
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Originally Posted by billium
I don't dispute your arguments as to whether a GM bankruptcy will have a big local, state and federal economic impact (although I disagree as to the extent of the impact at the national level), but again, I see any federal loans/bailout/leg up as simply delaying the inevitable. No one will be sending checks to me if I run my business into the ground and I don't expect them to. My employees make informed decisions every day as to whether it's in their best interest to continue to work for me or take a job with a competitor. No one can tell me that UAW employees haven't seen the writing on the wall with GM for years. What other company can you name that has made mutilple cash offers to non-retirement eligible employees to go find another career?
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Mercedes in Alabama is offering $100,000 buyouts to their employees (
link here) and Nissan in Tennessee is offering $100,000 buyouts as well (
link here ) - not multiple yet, but it's starting none-the-less.
Apparently the bad auto industry news that sinks in with people is when it's from Detroit. I have twenty-five years experience, a bachelors degree, plus extra skills in web site development and some basic IT work (basic network) - I've been unemployed for fourteen and a half months, and counting, and now the prospect of a Chrysler Chapter 11 filing or Cerberus selling off parts of Chrysler piecemeal threatens my wife's job. Our home that we paid $212,500 for ten years ago this past summer, won't go for $165,000 today. We didn't over buy - our employment position was decidedly better ten years ago, and we went the traditional 20% down, 30 year mortgage route. Selling today would mean wiping out all our equity, and my unemployment is burning through our savings.
That's the human cost of this situation, and the condescension I see, from politicians, regarding what amounts to a loan to the Detroit is rapidly getting on my nerves.
Consumer Reports has had high marks for Ford products, putting them nipping at Toyota's heels on quality. Takes time for reality to sink in with the market place.
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Originally Posted by billium
And I can and I do blame management. G. Richard (Rick) Wagoner, Jr., Frederick Henderson the Board of Directors specifically. Bob Lutz to a lesser degree. These folks were paid tens of millions of dollars to make the hard decisions that are best for the organization. Every one of them, to a person, should look up the definition of fiduciary responsibility. I'm sick of seeing no accountability from these big corporate CEO's, CFO's, COO's and their Board or Directors.
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So punish them, not the employees, suppliers and everyone that is dependent on these companies for a living. I agree - management screwed up - does that mean my risk of losing my house should go up?