Quote:
Originally Posted by Setec Astronomy
Ok, now I understand why you are so animated about this (BTW, I like to tell a story that is very similar in spirit but very different in circumstances, about a friend of a friend). But the tax changes being talked about are for people with INCOMES...i.e., people who WORK. I don't think any of the candidates since back when the primaries started has suggested that welfare and food stamps be increased.
Look, I almost voted for Perot in '92 because even though the Reagan budgets had been good for me professionally, I agreed that deficit spending was ultimately not. Clinton, probably mostly through coincidence rather than policy, was able to balance the budget and almost make the debt a moot point.
Now we have a debt and deficit that makes Reagan's work look amateurish. We sell more of our debt to China (the next superpower) every day. They have shot down a satellite and are about to orbit astronauts and perform a spacewalk. They will put a man on the moon before we get back there. Does anyone really believe that the money and jobs we send there every day will NOT result in them eclipsing us as the pre-eminent power in a matter of decades?
Our government is hemmorhaging money, and even if we somehow massively cut spending and balance the budget, this debt will bleed us dry. So we will need more tax revenue. Where is it going to come from? If you think that increasing taxes on people who make more than $603,000 will hurt your business and the economy, think what effect increasing your taxes and my taxes and the people who make $18,000 a year will have (which may be inevitable with these recent bailouts). I submit that the poor executives from Wall St. who may lose their jobs in this charade are going to be in a lot better shape than you and me unless they have been living like the King of Saudi Arabia and didn't put any money in the bank (I hope they didn't invest in Wall St.  ).
Personally I'd be embarrassed to be the CEO of Merrill Lynch and be the one who was driving when the company, the "bul"wark of Wall St., had to be sold, that I was being paid 10's of millions plus 10's more in bonus and was too stupid to recognize the company was buying huge amounts of bad debt (and if you believe these CEO's didn't know what was going on, then you believe Ken Lay didn't either), or embarrassed to be the CEO of GM, when they are caught with their pants down making Suburbans (or whatever they are now) when gas is $4/gal., and when they've had since the Arab Oil Embargo of '73 to change their ways. I used to really admire GM, but honestly, there is nothing to admire in these large corporations anymore, other than their ability to showcase executive greed.
I think we've talked this to death; our children and grandchildren will have to determine who was right in this debate. |
I don't think we have talked this to death because I enjoy your responses personally. I don't see us as opponents or argueeing, because in the end it is about what is best for the country as a whole. I am an American before any allegence to any party (of which I am conservative but NOT modern Republican).
We view things differently. You say you are embarrased because GM kept making Suburbans since '73. I am more embarrased that the public kept buying Suburbans.
It is similar to the morgage relief and the whole "bad banks" thing. Are people in this country that stupid that they cannot determine what they can and cannot afford? If we have gotten to the point as a country when we cannot realize we are being screwed, maybe we do need a big brother to watch over us. The only problem is that you start a slipperly slope where dependency grows more dependency.
I agree with your other post, regarding regulation of out-sourcing (though this is seperate then taxing). The problem though is that we are hypocrites (Americans). We say how outsourcing is bad, but if the TV was built in the US, with wages paid to workers that we have determined, how many of us would pony up 5k for a TV?
Americans seem to love buying things cheaply (realitively) and giving wealth to other countries so they could save a dollar. But when vote day comes, those same people will be line, voting to raise minimum wage (which only makes it harder to manufacturer in the US when more profits are avialable overseas), and give more rights to workers. BUT when it comes time to do their part (Americans) they run to the store and pick out a forgien brand for cheap, supporting low wages, poor working conditions (in other countries), and build wealth for the country who supports this behavior.
I don't really see it as a partisan issue (but I am ignorant). Something needs to change and something needed to change 5-10-15 years ago, which means both parites are to 'blame'.
As far as taxes, I think they need to go up universaly on every class.